Sezatoarea canadiana (90)
Raspunsuri - Pagina 8
Magdone spune:
Nu stiu daca sa ma bag si eu in discutie, poate ca o sa ziceti ca dupa 2 ani nu am cine stie ce experienta de Canada, dar totusi am sa zic si eu cate ceva
primul sentiment care l-am avut dupa ce am venit aici a fost cel de libertate, m-am simtit asa libera nu stiu de ce , ca nici in Romania nu eram in inchisoare ...si noi am am avut o situatie relativ buna, nu excelenta, aveam un apartament cu ipoteca, o masina, servicii bunicele si cam atat, dar nu simteam ca mergem inainte, mi se parea ca stam pe loc si in plus nu puteam sa ne permitem si noi o excursie undeva, asta era oful meu cel mare.
Faptul ca era si sora mea aici ne-a impulsionat si am mers mai departe. Ai mei inca sunt in Romania, mai avem si un frate care e la scoala inca, rude sunt, si prieteni am lasat vreo cativa, dar nu pot sa zic ca toate astea ma mai leaga de tara, noi am realizat in 2 ani aici mult mai multe decat am fi realizat in tara, tot din 2 salarii.
Pur si simplu la ora actuala consider ca nu as mai putea sa ma intorc vreodata, si nu simt nici o dorinta, nici o lipsa a nimic, mai putin a parintilor si fratelui, dar incercam sa-i aducem si pe ei aici.
asta e experienta mea...si consider ca am facut foarte bine cand am venit aici.
si pe mine ma mai deranjeaza unele, ca de ex iarna asta luunga, dar deh nicaieri nu e prefect.
Doriana, de ajutor social aici in Toronto, ca aici ziceati ca vreti sa veniti, eu zic ca nu o sa se puna problema, si in plus e imposibil de rezistat cu banii aia, cel putin eu n-am auzit pe nimeni sa traiasca din aj social aici.
Aj de somaj da, dar trebuie sa muncesti o perioada si apoi beneficiezi de el.
Khristin, felicitari pentru baietel!
Cristina, sa ne spui cum a fost!
Magdone 35+ si Razvan (19.07.2003)
_
"Pentru a castiga ceea ce merita sa ai, s-ar putea sa fie nevoie sa renunti la tot ceea ce ai deja."
try spune:
Mqqm ti-a raspuns bine la intrebari.
A propos de lucru la negru... se mai poate, depinde in ce fel de cercuri te mai invarti, depinde de ce fel de munca de jos esti dispus sa faci. Munca la negru intr-un birou... asta nu, dar caraus cu spatele la magazinul din colt, chelnerita pe la vreun restaurant, faiantzar sau munca de jos in construnctii, da, se poate si la negru. Insa nimeni nu traverseaza oceanul sa faca astfel de lucruri decat daca e nevoit (si numai pt o perioada scurta de timp, ca plan alternativ de supravietuire): sotia face scoala, el nu gaseste un serviciu si trebuie un venit in casa (pt ca e foarte limitativ sa traiesti pe ajutorul social, daca e sa te bazezi pe ajutor social, atunci se nuemste ca vegetezi, nu ca traiesti).
Doriana, o buna abordare e sa dai aici de romani care lucreaza deja de cativa ani in domeniul in care vrei tu sau sotul sa lucrati. Ei sunt cei mai in masura sa-ti dea informatii pertinente , ei stiu cel mai bine care e calea cea mai rapida sau mai putin costisitoare sau mai sigura sa ajungi aici sa profesezi x meserie.
Lumea e mereu dornica sa dea sfaturi despre orice, insa te poti trezi cu sfaturi neavizate cum sa te faci inginer de la unu' care face web design in Canada. Deci e important sa gasesti acele surse pertinente.
Si-t ispu nacum povestea unui amic de-al nostru venit singur aici la 36 de ani, a stat o luna la noi. In Ro fusese in primii ani dupa facultate inginer geolog/topograf, apoi s-a facut agent de vanzari. Venit aici, a vrut sa-si reia topografia si sa uite de sales. Venit cu fix 900$ in buzunar (dar fiind si singur, fara nici o obligatie fatza de nimeni) -desi no iam zis ca nu e in toate mintile . Barbate-miu il tot impingea de la spate sa se duca la orice fel de job, caci avand in vedere cei 900$, nu poate rezista nici o luna pe cont propriu si ca nu-i in situatia sa-si permita nazuri "vreau cutare sau cutare domeniu/job". El o tinea una si buna ca vrea geologie/topografie. Noi i-am facut cunostinta cu toate persoanele posibile pe care le stiam noi (ca mai mult n uaveam cu ce sa-l ajutam) si l-am sfatuit sa tina legatura cu ei, sa-si intinda antenele la maxim. Unul din vecinii nostri de bloc si amici cu noi (era real estate, deci cu baza mare de date ) stia o alta tipa venita de ceva ani buni in Canada care, intamplator, lucra la guvern deja pe probleme de topografie. Ei, tipa s-a dovedit a fi foarte saritoare, plus ca stia toate firmele de topografie din Toronto, aia fiind clienti ai guvernului pe diverse probleme. A doau zi dupa ce-a vorbit cu ea, tipa i-a oferit chiar doua alternative unde poate sa lucreze si in nici o sapt. era angajat. Asta s-a intamplat dupa fix o luna dupa ce aterizase in Canada. Apoi ne-am dat seama si noi (din exemplul lui) ca e foarte important sa stii ce vrei si sa cauti sursele alea care sa-ti ofere cea mai buna imagine despre ce ai de facut ca sa ajungi la firma/postul/meseria pe care le vrei. Norocul lui a fost ca a gasit f repede omul potrivit, cu relatiile cele mai bune si ca s-a mai dovedit a fi si un om deosebit care n-a pregetat (vorba lu' mamaie! dar asta e primul cuvant care mi-a venit in minte) sa-i ofere tot sprijinul. Chiar daca aceasta sursa insa nu te poate ajuta direct sa intri pe un anumit post/firma, dar macar iti arata care-ti sunt alternativele si tu nu mai stai sa bajbai ani de zile incotro s-o apuci, ci stii din capul locului daca meseria/firma respectiva e pt tine sau nu.
PS: Adevarul e ca si noi vroiam sa-l vedem odata plecat la casa lui pe amicul asta pt ca eu de 7 luni ma chinuiam sa raman insarcinata (sotul lucra pe schimb de noapte atunci si ne vedeam fix 4 ore/zi de la 2am la 6am) si nu-mi ardea de musafiri prin casa (intr-un one bedroom appartment) .
"Tot ceea ce nu te doboara, te face mai puternic"
Alex (3 ani) si Adrian (1.5 ani) ..... poze I, www.flickr.com/photos/8947508@N02/" target="_blank"> II si III
try spune:
Hai ca deja am inflatie de mesaje - se vede ca-i vineri si n-am chef de munca - scuze daca deja deranejaza la ochi pe cineva.
Magdone, vechi sau nou, ai dreptul la o opinie - ca doar ea reflecta experienta si trairile tale de pana acum. Daca ai doar 2 ani vechime nu inseamna ca esti mai putin indreptatit in a-ti spune parerea.
"Tot ceea ce nu te doboara, te face mai puternic"
Alex (3 ani) si Adrian (1.5 ani) ..... poze I, www.flickr.com/photos/8947508@N02/" target="_blank"> II si III
Ktrinel spune:
Try ,..apropo de impulsuri, l-ai ajutat si tu cu ganduri bune, nu??
magdone, ei , cum e cu piata carucioarelor? ai gasit ceva?
simonna, te plangeai de plictiseala, de timp liber...cum mai sta treaba...te-ai relaxat la maxim de nu mai intri? sau plivesti leusteanul?
lorelaim spune:
Nu ca sa tai cumva celor intresatzi dorintza de a emigra... ci doar pt ca tocmai mi-am facut informarea politic ;-)
http://www.thestar.com/Canada/Census/article/420670
GTA middle class struggles TheStar.com - Census - GTA middle class struggles
Gap between rich and poor widens while the centre lags, census figures show
May 02, 2008
Laurie Monsebraaten
Staff Reporter
The gap between the rich and poor widened, and new immigrants continued to lose ground while middle income earners struggled to keep pace, according to the 2006 Canadian census released yesterday.
Nowhere are these national trends more pronounced than in the Toronto area, home to the country's largest percentage of new immigrants.
As a result, median family incomes (the point at which half are higher and half are lower) in the Toronto area dropped between 2000 and 2005 while they rose across Ontario and the rest of the country.
"We are becoming a city of the servant class – who earn servant wages and live in the city's northern suburbs – and the downtown elite who run everything," said University of Toronto urban studies professor David Hulchanski.
"Immigrants who used to come to this country came for middle-income jobs in construction that were unionized and well paying. Today they can't find those jobs. They are locked out by unions or education we don't recognize, or lack of Canadian experience," he said. "So they clean our offices and hotels and universities, drive our taxis and cook our meals."
The income gap in Canada has been widening for a quarter century, according to the census.
Between 1980 and 2005, median earnings for the top 20 per cent of full-time, full-year earners in Canada increased by 16.4 per cent. By contrast, median earnings in the bottom one-fifth fell 20.6 per cent. Meanwhile, median earnings of those in the middle stagnated, inching from $41,348 in 1980 to just $41,401 when calculated in 2005 dollars.
Recent immigrant men with employment income in 1980 earned 85 cents for each dollar earned by Canadian-born men. But by 2005, the ratio had dropped to 63 cents. It was even worse for recent immigrant women, whose corresponding earnings were 85 cents and 56 cents, respectively.
Harjot Mangat, a 35-year-old lawyer from India, completed an MBA from Leeds University Business School in England before immigrating to Toronto in 2004. But the only work he has been able to find is selling electronics. "Even though my MBA is recognized by U of T, I quickly realized without Canadian experience no one was interested in hiring me," he said.
When he switched tactics and earned a diploma as a certified immigration consultant, no one would hire him because they were worried he'd compete for business, Mangat said.
So now he's trying to put his MBA to work through a website www.help4immigrants.com. "It's not about whether you are white or brown," Mangat said. "It's about the haves and have-nots. The haves don't want to let you in."
Mangat's wife, Deepa, 32, came with the same credentials and also had to settle for retail work until last spring when she was hired by the South Asian Legal Clinic of Ontario as a project manager. But her $52,000 income is a far cry from the six-figure incomes most lawyers with MBAs in Toronto command.
"The drop in immigrant women's wages should be a wake-up call for action by this government," said Toronto MP Olivia Chow (NDP-Trinity-Spadina).
"We're bringing in people with university degrees and they are delivering pizzas," Chow said.
Across the Toronto area, median family incomes dropped to $77,693 in 2005 from $75,829 in 2000. The 2.4 per cent decrease compares with a national increase of 3.7 per cent and a provincial increase of 1.4 per cent.
"This report points to the need for leadership by senior governments," said Rob Rainer, executive director of the National Anti-Poverty Organization. "At the extreme, this gap is personified by knowledge that the highest paid CEOs in Canada earn in about 13 hours what a full-time, minimum wage worker can hope to earn in an entire year."
In Toronto, middle-income neighbourhoods are disappearing, while rich and poor neighbourhoods continue to grow, said Hulchanski, who has tracked Statistics Canada income data for the GTA since 1970.
Since 2000 in the city of Toronto, only the very top and the very bottom income categories grew, he said. As a result, the city has more wealthy neighbourhoods, fewer middle-income areas, and more very poor neighbourhoods.
For the 905, only the two bottom income categories grew. It has about the same number of wealthy neighbourhoods, a decline in middle-income neighbourhoods and more growth in poorer neighbourhoods since 2000, he said.
The national numbers paint a rosier picture. Over the past 25 years, median incomes of Canadian families rose by 9.3 per cent to $63,715. Couples with children had the highest median income of all family types in 2005 at $82,943, up 21.6% from 1980, mostly due to the increase in the number of dual-earner families.
The median income of senior couples was $45,674 in 2005, a whopping 55.8 per cent increase from 1980, largely due to payouts from the Canada Pension Plan and personal savings.
However, the incidence of children living in low income families across Canada has changed very little over the past quarter-century.
The before-tax low income rate in 2005 for families with preschoolers was 19.3 per cent and 17 per cent for school-age children, compared to 20 per cent and 18.7 per cent respectively in 1980.
After taxes, there were 879,955 Canadian children living in poverty in 2005, according to the census.
"We aren't happy to see this and it speaks even more strongly for the need for action, especially with several provinces on the move with poverty reduction strategies," said Ann Decter, head of Campaign 2000, a national coalition seeking to hold Parliament to its pledge to end child poverty by 2000.
"It limits what they can do without the federal government taking action."
http://www.thestar.com/News/Canada/article/420336
Highly educated immigrants still lag in earnings TheStar.com - Census - Highly educated immigrants still lag in earnings
May 01, 2008
Colin Perkel
THE CANADIAN PRESS
Piloting his cab through the congested streets of Toronto, Ifzal Ahmad is looking forward to the day when he can come up with $35,000 for a course that should allow him to again become a mechanical engineer.
Despite 15 years in his profession in India, the 47-year-old married father of three – like so many other new arrivals to Canada – has found himself in a relatively low-skilled job because his qualifications aren't recognized here.
The latest data on income and earnings from the 2006 census released Thursday by Statistics Canada shows that highly skilled immigrants – the country's preferred newcomer – have a long row to hoe once they arrive, and it shows in the amount of money they earn.
The past quarter century has seen the earnings gap between recent immigrant workers and Canadian-born ones widen dramatically.
In 1980, recent immigrant men earned 85 cents for every dollar of their Canadian-born counterparts. In 2005, that number plummeted to 63 cents. The drop was even more pronounced for immigrant women, who went from earning 85 cents by comparison in 1980 to only 56 cents in 2005.
Having a university degree didn't help either.
Recent immigrant men holding a degree earned only 48 cents for each dollar their university educated, Canadian-born counterparts did. Some 30 per cent of male immigrants with a university degree worked in jobs that required no more than a high-school education – more than twice the rate of those born in Canada.
The gap was actually less for non-university educated immigrants, who earned 61 cents to every dollar earned by their Canadian-born counterparts.
"That's not right because when you apply for immigration, they check all your degrees and send all your degrees to Canada for verification," Ahmad said after dropping off his latest fare.
The lack of recognition of his qualifications or experience in a textiles factory managing 2,000 people, he said, came as a huge blow, as did the dilemma of trying to get Canadian experience when no one will give him work.
"Wherever you apply for a job, they say, 'Do you have Canadian education? Do you have Canadian experience?"'
The reason for the dramatic divide, Statistics Canada reported Thursday, was the decline in the information and communication technologies sector between 2000 and 2004. A disproportionately high share of those workers were trained in computer sciences and engineering, the agency said.
Rene Morissette, lead analyst with Statistics Canada, said it is well documented that foreign experience has been increasingly undervalued.
The trend started in 1980, when immigrants began to see their earnings level fall even though their educational levels "grew remarkably" compared to those of Canadian-born workers.
"The group of people that were hit the most were the older recent immigrants," Morissette said.
"This amount of experience in your (home) country is no longer rewarded the way it used to be, if it has any rewards at all."
Analysts have put forward several explanations for the disparity. Employers may simply not appreciate or trust the quality of higher education in a country with which they are unfamiliar.
It can also be challenging for employers faced with the usual issue of orienting new employees to deal with the added problem of taking on someone with different language skills or cultural values. Others wonder if there aren't simply too many newcomers for the labour market to absorb.
Then, there is perhaps the most sensitive issue.
"There might also simply be discrimination," said Morissette. ``But this is awfully hard to test empirically."
The new census data do show the earnings gap for recent arrivals aged between 25 and 34 who completed the final phase of their higher education in Canada also fare worse than their Canadian-born counterparts, suggesting something beyond credential recognition is an issue.
Ernie Lightman, an economist at the University Toronto, is convinced employer discrimination is the real reason many immigrants struggle.
Lightman did a study in 2006 of former welfare recipients in Toronto that found the foreign-born, despite having relatively superior education levels, fared worse than their Canadian-born cohort, even when moving onto a second post-welfare job.
The study also found immigrants were actually worse off financially after leaving welfare.
"Clearly, their education was not useful or usable in Canada," Lightman said.
"The only explanation I can come up with is discrimination or racism or barriers in the workforce."
Lightman does concede that other issues, such as language skills may explain at least some of the discrepancy, but notes the earnings gap widened at the same time as immigrants became increasingly non-white.
"I cannot prove racism or discrimination, but I have no problem believing that's what's going on here for lack of a better explanation," Lightman said.
Politicians across the country have recognized the significant barriers skilled foreigners face in landing on their feet in the workplace once they arrive in Canada.
Ontario, for example, legislated an independent agency a year ago to ensure skilled newcomers have fair access to 34 self-regulating professions with penalties of up to $100,000 for mistreatment.
Across the country, some self-regulating bodies have made a concerted effort to streamline their recognition procedures. For others, the process remains slow and painful.
"This is a Goliath and we're nibbling at its toes," Timothy Welsh, of the Canadian Immigrant Settlement Sector Alliance, said from Vancouver.
"What we're seeing is a lot more collective will (but) whether that's making a difference for everybody right now is less clear because it's such a complex issue."
Part of the problem relates to Canada's devolved federal system itself in which rules differ from province to province and, within that system, self-regulating bodies set their own rules for qualifications and standards of practice.
In all, there are about 400 licensing bodies in Canada – just for the various professions.
Last year, the federal government committed $30 million over five years to the new Foreign Credentials Referral Office, which is designed to help those trained abroad get their credentials assessed and recognized more quickly.
"Too many newcomers can't get jobs they have been trained for," Immigration Minister Diane Finley said at the time. "That's a terrible waste, for them – and for the country."
But Welsh, whose organization represents 450 immigrant and refugee service agencies across Canada, said while the office can provide information and general leadership, its scope remains limited as a federal body dealing with various provincial governments and provincially mandated agencies.
One area that needs to be looked at, he said, is whether Ottawa's focus on recruiting skilled professionals abroad even makes sense given, for example, the need for trades and unskilled labour in provinces such as B.C.
In the interim, Ahmad plans to apply soon for a provincial loan that will help him pay for a course he hopes will lead him back to the kind of career he believes he should be pursuing.
"If we get the opportunities, we can prove our worth," Ahmad said.
Lorelai
http://community.webshots.com/user/UndevaCandva
"Daca dragoste nu e... nimic nu e..."
clau07 spune:
Buna fetelor,
NU am mai apucat sa va citesc de mult. Din 1 martie am inceput lucrul si la birou nu am intrat pe internet iar acasa cand ajung nu mai apuc . Am intrat astazi pentru ca primind cecul de plata, seful meu mi-a spus ca nu mai are nevoie de serviciile mele. Perioada de impozite e terminata si pe perioada verii nu au foarte mult de lucru. Am fost de-a dreptul socata si nu imi venea sa cred ca mi se intimpla asa ceva. De luni voi avea mai mult timp liber si voi fi mai activa pe forum. Mi-ati lipsit tare mult
Va doresc un week-end placut tuturor ( chiar daca o sa ploua in MOntreal)si o sa incerc sa recuperez ceea ce am pierdut din discutiile de pe forum in perioada viitoare.
Ktrinel spune:
clau, imi pare ff rau..ce neplacut...era job pe contract, temporar, permanent, de care? oricum a fost, a fost...bafta in continuare.
columbiana spune:
Claudia, imi pare rau, sincer! si eu cam tremur, tot pentru acelasi motiv: suntem doua persoane (controloarea+eu) pentru o firma de 20 oameni in total-si vad ca lucrul scade...asta e daca avem un kkt de meserie la care tot boboru'quebecos se pricepe.
iti tin pumnii sa-ti gasesti rapid altceva, bafta!
Loreleim, uite, fraza asta ar trebui bagata sub nasul multor quebsi de care am dat eu pe la joburi pe aici:noroc cu Ontario ca exista pe harta Canadei si se mai spune lucrurilor pe nume.
"The only explanation I can come up with is discrimination or racism or barriers in the workforce."
Ana
http://www.floriinro.ro/
credinta vede invizibilul, crede incredibilul si primeste de la Dumnezeu imposibilul
cge spune:
Claudia, imi pare rau ce ti s-a ntamplat.
Dar vei vedea ca orice sut e un pas inainte.
Dc vrei, putem vb pe PM poate exista la mine la scarbiciu vreun post care te avantajeaza.
Tare am vrut sa va scriu povestea emigrarii noastre, dar nu am apucat la scarbiciu am avut multa treaba si acum sunt obosita.
Pe scurt, nu iubim Canada, dar uram Romania, ca din cauza conditiilor de acolo, ne-am lasat parintii, sora ca sa putem avea o viata "normala". De fapt asta am castigat aici, ca nu mai alergam dupa normalitate, aici normalitatea se intampla pur si simplu.
Doriana, e greu aici fara parinti si prieteni, experienta emigrarii nu e usoara, dar se merita. Ptr copii in primul rand dar si pentru voi.
Noi suntem boboceii de aici, suntem in Ca numai de 9 luni, asa ca avem proaspete amintirile din Ro si stim tot ce povestesti si fiindca am venit cu 2 copii in bagaje.
Victor al nostru a facut clasa 1 in Ro, asa ca putem compara si scolile din cele 2 tari.
Si eu zic ca si Oana, ca nici o tara nu e perfecta, si ca trebuie sa invatam sa traim si cu partile negative(exempu, iarna).
Noi inca n-am prins radacini in Ca, si nici nu prea cred ca vom prindre. Am mai emigra si prin alte parti (de ex. Franta) dc la un moment dat s-ar ivi vreo ocazie.
Am venit hotarati sa ne stabilim aici, ne place viata noastra de acum, dar inca nu ne simtim ca acasa.
Multa bafta si felicitari ptr poze si copii.
Ajunge cat am scris, un weekend placut.
Cristina,
mama lui Victor 07.01.2000 si a Ancai 16.09.2005
lorelaim spune:
Eu de-abia astept sa aud ca si in Suedia se intampla la fel... din pacate inca mai vin "azilantzi" :-(
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/articles/news/news.html?in_article_id=563463&in_page_id=1770&ct=5
'We're fed up with the cold weather and the NHS,' say asylum seekers trying to break OUT of BritainBy JAMES SLACK - More by this author »
Last updated at 01:36am on 3rd May 2008
Illegal immigrants are leaving the country in search of warmer weather and better health care.
Failed asylum seekers are sneaking out of Britain - because they are fed up with the poor healthcare and bad weather.
Scores have been caught trying to break past border controls in recent weeks, according to immigration staff.
The majority of those who have been found are from Afghanistan and Iraq, said Les Williams, a chief immigration officer for the UK Border Agency.
He said: "One thing we have noticed recently is people trying to leave the country.
"We cannot explain exactly why they are trying to go, but when some of these people were questioned they said they wanted to go to a warmer country as they are fed up with the English weather and fed up with their treatment on the NHS."
Many of the illegals told him they planned to head for Italy after hearing rumours that the government would introduce an amnesty for asylum seekers, he said in the interview with Police Review magazine.
Mr Williams said: "Italy was mentioned as a destination on several occasions."
A second immigration insider said he had stopped a group of four Iraqis trying to sneak out of the port of Dover.
He said: "There has been a big rise in the number of illegals we are catching sneaking out of the country."
"A group of four men from Iraq I stopped recently said they were sick of the rain and the cold and just wanted to get home or go to somewhere with a bit more sun.
"They also complained that they couldn't get appointments to see a doctor or a dentist. It's all a bit rich really."
When caught trying to breach the borders, fugitives cannot simply be let go. This because the Home Office needs to establish whether they are wanted criminals.
However, as critics point out, those who are found not to be criminals must have costly deportation proceedings begun against them.
Mark Wallace, campaign director for the Taxpayers' Alliance, said: "At a time when police are overstretched and taxpayers are paying far too much we are spending millions stopping these people leaving the country.
"It is lunacy and makes us even more of a laughing stock."
Others claim failed asylum seekers leaving voluntarily is probably the best hope the Home Office has of clearing a backlog of 285,000 cases.
Asylum removals have slumped over the past year, as officials instead concentrate on removing foreign national criminals.
The number of failed asylum seekers and their dependants removed fell last year by more than a quarter.
There were 13,595 removed in 2007, compared with more than 18,000 the previous year. At that rate, even with no new arrivals, it would take 21 years to clear the backlog.
Tory immigration spokesman Damian Green said: "Surely even this Government can't be trying to solve the immigration crisis by making Britain increasingly impossible to live in.
"Sometimes you don't know whether to laugh or cry."
Mr Williams was speaking ahead of a cross-Channel intelligence conference on crime, people smuggling and counter-terrorism.
Lorelai
http://community.webshots.com/user/UndevaCandva
"Daca dragoste nu e... nimic nu e..."